Annoyed After Vet Visit
- GoEmGo
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- First Name: Emma
- Dog #1: Montgomery (Monty)
- is a: White Mini Dog
- Born: 22 Dec 2018
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Annoyed After Vet Visit
This is just a rant really.... I need to vent! Apologies in advance.
I don't know if anyone has been following Monty's tummy/food issues, but he is finally on food that agrees with him, no soft poops, no vomiting. And his being adorable and marvellous!
Fast forward five days or so and yesterday evening Monty went to the vet for his second vaccination.
We got there and the vet seemed pleasant enough. She asked how Monty was getting on, asked about crating, his food, and any health issues, but I felt she wasn't really listening to the answers. She merely launched into a sales pitch about their insurance, VIP plan thing, groomers, etc etc. Then she had to google a flea treatment that Monty was given a fortnight previously as she'd never heard of it. She said he needed another treatment (I refused!)
Then came vaccination time. She brought out about twenty treats for him to gobble while having the injection and they wee pretty chunky heart shaped biscuit things. I said he had a sensitive tummy and I didn't want him to have them. She was adamant that he needed something to distract. I pulled out his favourite toy. She ignored this and proceeded to give him about a dozen of the treats that Monty did indeed gobble up without crunching or chewing, and he swallowed them whole. He didn't flinch with the jab but this wasn't the point. I asked what the treats were. She had no idea. How can a vet not even know what they are giving puppies!?!?
Anyway, we get home ten minutes later and within the hour he vomits all the treats back up undigested. I call the vet back and they tell me to monitor him until the morning or if he vomits again I need to take him back in just in case it's a reaction to the vaccine. He flakes out and sleeps from 7:30pm through to 6:30am (albeit with a 2:30am wee) and didn't have his last meal of the day. He usually sleeps 10:30pm until 6:00am.
I think I'm annoyed with myself more than anything that I didn't stand my ground with the treats and the vet. I feel like I know Monty very well now, and he doesn't take to new foods. One treat maybe, but a dozen, not a chance. I feel like making a complaint. Needless to say we will be finding another vet. Sorry for the rant. Just needed to let off steam. Luckily Monty has had his brekkie and elevenses and seems ok - poos are a tad soft but no vomiting. I'm hoping he gets back to normal relatively quickly.
I don't know if anyone has been following Monty's tummy/food issues, but he is finally on food that agrees with him, no soft poops, no vomiting. And his being adorable and marvellous!
Fast forward five days or so and yesterday evening Monty went to the vet for his second vaccination.
We got there and the vet seemed pleasant enough. She asked how Monty was getting on, asked about crating, his food, and any health issues, but I felt she wasn't really listening to the answers. She merely launched into a sales pitch about their insurance, VIP plan thing, groomers, etc etc. Then she had to google a flea treatment that Monty was given a fortnight previously as she'd never heard of it. She said he needed another treatment (I refused!)
Then came vaccination time. She brought out about twenty treats for him to gobble while having the injection and they wee pretty chunky heart shaped biscuit things. I said he had a sensitive tummy and I didn't want him to have them. She was adamant that he needed something to distract. I pulled out his favourite toy. She ignored this and proceeded to give him about a dozen of the treats that Monty did indeed gobble up without crunching or chewing, and he swallowed them whole. He didn't flinch with the jab but this wasn't the point. I asked what the treats were. She had no idea. How can a vet not even know what they are giving puppies!?!?
Anyway, we get home ten minutes later and within the hour he vomits all the treats back up undigested. I call the vet back and they tell me to monitor him until the morning or if he vomits again I need to take him back in just in case it's a reaction to the vaccine. He flakes out and sleeps from 7:30pm through to 6:30am (albeit with a 2:30am wee) and didn't have his last meal of the day. He usually sleeps 10:30pm until 6:00am.
I think I'm annoyed with myself more than anything that I didn't stand my ground with the treats and the vet. I feel like I know Monty very well now, and he doesn't take to new foods. One treat maybe, but a dozen, not a chance. I feel like making a complaint. Needless to say we will be finding another vet. Sorry for the rant. Just needed to let off steam. Luckily Monty has had his brekkie and elevenses and seems ok - poos are a tad soft but no vomiting. I'm hoping he gets back to normal relatively quickly.
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
Emma, the trouble is we can lose your voice when dealing with a vet in a uniform. You are absolutely right about the treats, they should always ask if he/she can be given a treat before giving one. My vet normally asks if he can give a gravy bone after the procedure has been done. A similar thing happened to me at our puppy training class. I foolishly let the trainer hand out a kong full of yucky puppy feed which she said was for sensitive tums, I hesitated and against my better judgement gave it to Otto. It was used to train him to settle. Now if the trainers had told me they were going to do this before the event I would have brought my own kong and stuffed it with food I know he was ok with. Of course Otto had a tummy upset for 2 days. I was so annoyed with myself for letting him down. Never ever again and I did tell the trainers the following week that they should warn people beforehand. One puppy in the class was raw fed and her owner didn't quite know what to do either. Annoying also about them pushing their puppy pack things where everything is included. Don't beat yourself up about it, put it down to experience, you find you acquire quite a lot of this experience when they are puppies. Hope he is back to normal soon.
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we also need a schnauzer.
we also need a schnauzer.
- mikegoodson1
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
Hi Emma, One thing I have learnt with having Oscar then Sasha is that they are your priority and you know them better than anyone. Don't be fooled by that 'vet thing' that we all assume they know best, they don't, not in the case of our dogs. I don't think they necessarily do it on purpose but don't be afraid to stand your ground or ask more questions and if you are not happy with the answer, then ask another question and keep asking until you are either happy to stay or happy to leave.
I have been following your posts about Monty and I'm hoping he 'just' threw up the un-digested treats rather than there being anything more sinister going on but I'm surprised the vet didn't listen to you when you said he had a sensitive tummy. Even when out walking, I always ask the owner if I can give their dog a treat if the situation arises, I never assume and I'm not a vet who should know better!
Like I said at the beginning, you know Monty better than anyone and as he cannot speak for himself, you are his voice
Hopefully Monty is okay today and back to his normal self.
I have been following your posts about Monty and I'm hoping he 'just' threw up the un-digested treats rather than there being anything more sinister going on but I'm surprised the vet didn't listen to you when you said he had a sensitive tummy. Even when out walking, I always ask the owner if I can give their dog a treat if the situation arises, I never assume and I'm not a vet who should know better!
Like I said at the beginning, you know Monty better than anyone and as he cannot speak for himself, you are his voice
Hopefully Monty is okay today and back to his normal self.
- GoEmGo
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- mikegoodson1
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
He really is a 'cuteness overload' - if I wasn't working, we would definitely be looking to add a 'Monty' to our clan
- jacdales
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
Monty is very cute. My vet is an independent practice so no real hard sell. They offer flea and worm treatments I just say I have some . They always ask if the dog can have a treat. I used to take a few treats with me for one of my dogs that had several allergies. I read an article that a lot of vets now buy into a franchised practice and the pets at home or shop like that is one of them, they want you to pay so much a month and you get the wormers etc whether you need them or not as well as annual boosters. Try to look for a new vet you are happy with and trust. I've been with the local practice for 24 years now and they have looked after 5 airedales a welsh terrier and 2 schnauzers over that time.
- Susan H
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
Agree that you were upset with treat things. Dorothy has never had problems with reactions to treats etc as from the time I had her at 8 weeks old I have never really given her treats and always said to all and sundry who offer that she she does not do treats. She is now 6 I do occassionally personally give her the odd rare treat but in reality she has 2 good quality meals a day and does not do treats ... horrid me because i am sure she would love to stuff her guts if she got the chance , but hey ho xxx
Toby, Standard Poodle 1983 - 1999, Bertie, Cocker Spaniel 1999 - 2012, Dorothy BS Mini Schnauzer Sept 2012
- mikegoodson1
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
Following on from the 'vet' comments, I had a very interesting conversation last year at my local vets with a locum, he was absolutely excellent with my two dogs and I wanted to follow him to his practise (if he had one). The surgeons and nurses at my usual practise are ok but they are part of a chain now and so they are rotated regularly among the other practises and besides which, our practise is the smallest and now often during the week, there are no surgeons there at all. Even when they were there, there was no consistency which is what I was hoping for, to get to see the same vet pretty much all the time and for the vet to get to know my dogs and they to be comfortable with the vet.
Anyway, he was telling me that many vet practises were run by older people and that these chains just buy them up when the vet owner retires and many of these large practises invest in their own medication too. My two were on Simparica (rightly or wrongly) which we used to get from our vet but now, the vet doesn't provide that, it's now an 'own brand' and it seems that this happens more and more.
The locum told me that he had worked at Fitzpatrick Referrals but was now going to be working at another hospital, which was a shame, as I said, he was excellent with my dogs. He listened to me, had a great way with them and you just knew he knew what he was doing.
It's such a shame that there seems to be less and less 'independent' vets around but I am seriously considering moving to one, if I can find one.......
Anyway, he was telling me that many vet practises were run by older people and that these chains just buy them up when the vet owner retires and many of these large practises invest in their own medication too. My two were on Simparica (rightly or wrongly) which we used to get from our vet but now, the vet doesn't provide that, it's now an 'own brand' and it seems that this happens more and more.
The locum told me that he had worked at Fitzpatrick Referrals but was now going to be working at another hospital, which was a shame, as I said, he was excellent with my dogs. He listened to me, had a great way with them and you just knew he knew what he was doing.
It's such a shame that there seems to be less and less 'independent' vets around but I am seriously considering moving to one, if I can find one.......
- Schnauzer Sam
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
My local vets is independent. It has 7 or 8 vets working there and it's owned by 3 of them. I'd been seeing one of the other vets every time (through choice) as, like Mike, I wanted to establish a relationship with one vet so they would get to know Rosie and Edie.
We were delighted with this young vet; with any of the other vets Rosie's anxiety would boil over into growling and I wasn't confident what the outcome would be and so I suggested we'd muzzle her. With my preferred vet, this wasn't necessary.
Sadly, he moved on a few weeks ago (Gone off to be a vet on Galapagos - a no brainer for him). He supported my views on vaccinations (using titer instead of annual even though the practice policy is for annual boosters) and was happy not to use lepto 4 when again it's the practice norm. He just "got me".
I'd encourage everyone to ensure they find a vet they can have a conversation with, who will listen to your concerns and explain what and why the treatment they propose is best for your dogs.
We were delighted with this young vet; with any of the other vets Rosie's anxiety would boil over into growling and I wasn't confident what the outcome would be and so I suggested we'd muzzle her. With my preferred vet, this wasn't necessary.
Sadly, he moved on a few weeks ago (Gone off to be a vet on Galapagos - a no brainer for him). He supported my views on vaccinations (using titer instead of annual even though the practice policy is for annual boosters) and was happy not to use lepto 4 when again it's the practice norm. He just "got me".
I'd encourage everyone to ensure they find a vet they can have a conversation with, who will listen to your concerns and explain what and why the treatment they propose is best for your dogs.
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- zeta1454
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Re: Annoyed After Vet Visit
Looking for a truly independent vet surgery is becoming increasingly difficult since deregulation enabled private companies / individuals with no professional veterinary training to take over or buy up vet practices in order to maximise profits for their shareholders. Over the past decade or so, this has led to a large number of vet surgeries (who may retain the outward appearance of independence) actually being part of a corporate business. These companies make their money by encouraging or financially rewarding employees at the surgeries to promote "pet health schemes" to tie in clients to regular payments for anti-parasitic (flea / worms) treatments and annual vaccinations which are at best unnecessary and worst case can actually lead to poor health. Some such as CVS, one of the biggest corporate owners of vet surgeries also makes their own brand pharmaceuticals, pet food and promote their own laboratories, referral centres and pet crematoria through the surgeries they own.
The following quotes illustrate the developing situation re surgeries in the UK (and Europe):
From the Daily Telegraph 2017:
"There has been significant transformation of the UK veterinary practice ownership by corporatisation over the past decade and this trend is likely to continue. Currently, around 30% of vet practices are owned by corporates, and this is expected to rise to 50% by the end of 2018, perhaps peaking at 70% within five years. So most pet owners will soon be taking their pets to vet clinics owned by a corporate entity rather than by the traditional independent vet running his own small business. This change will bring benefits (e.g. economies of scale, efficient protocols, standardisation of care) but may have drawbacks too ( e.g. arguably a higher focus on profit, less clinical freedom for vets, more remote management of day to day clinic happenings)."
From Vet Times May 2018
"Since the rules were changed almost 20 years ago to allow non-vets to own practices, the number of sites owned by corporate groups has grown to more than 1,700.
Independent Vetcare, the UK’s largest corporate with more than 500 sites, employs 2,800 veterinary professionals, CVS 3,250, Vets4Pets has 2,450, Medivet 1,850, VetPartners employs 1,250 and Linnaeus has 325 vets.
This means almost 12,000 vets and VNs work for a corporate veterinary group."
And this section from an article in The Times newspaper a year or so back highlights one of the potential consequences when huge corporations own the vet surgery as regards loss of individual choice when it comes to vets recommending what they regard as the best treatment for an individual pet and / or smaller scale companies being unable to compete when corporates use surgeries to promote their own products:
"A dogfight has broken out between Britain’s biggest chain of vets and a supplier of pet supplements that accuses it of misleading claims, of “losing the plot” and of being prepared to do anything in pursuit of profit.
David Haythornthwaite, founder of Vetplus, claims that his entire range of products, including his bestselling treatment for joint stiffness in labradors and alsatians, has been blackballed by the veterinary chain Independent Vetcare (IVC) at the behest of senior managers and private equity masters wanting to push own-brand products."
If it is impossible to find a truly independent, reputable veterinary surgery within a reasonable distance from your home, register with the one that offers the best service as regards out of hours care, quality treatment etc. but be prepared to resist unwanted offers of monthly payment plans for non-essential treatments (repeat vaccinations/ anti-flea and worm treatments). Easy to use worm count tests are available to purchase to check your dog for worm infestation and fleas are obvious to see if your dog has them and there is no need to treat unless affected. Once a puppy is successfully immunised against Distemper, Canine Adenovirus (Hepatitis) and Parvovirus, they do not need re-vaccination and a titre test can reassure if required that the dog has antibodies to those diseases. Re-vaccinating a dog that is already protected is a waste of money and, due to the potential health risks associated with over-vaccination, can be actually undermining the dog's health.
As Sam said above, try to find a vet that you can trust and is willing to discuss matters relating to your dog based on the most up to date advice (and common sense!) rather than with an eye to profit. A healthy dog should not need to be constantly at the vet surgery - we have dogs of 5 years and 8 years of age who have had only one vet visit since they were puppies, and the 5 year old only went when we needed the vet to perform a patella test as required by the breed Club - not because she had any ailment. She passed the test with flying colours too
The following quotes illustrate the developing situation re surgeries in the UK (and Europe):
From the Daily Telegraph 2017:
"There has been significant transformation of the UK veterinary practice ownership by corporatisation over the past decade and this trend is likely to continue. Currently, around 30% of vet practices are owned by corporates, and this is expected to rise to 50% by the end of 2018, perhaps peaking at 70% within five years. So most pet owners will soon be taking their pets to vet clinics owned by a corporate entity rather than by the traditional independent vet running his own small business. This change will bring benefits (e.g. economies of scale, efficient protocols, standardisation of care) but may have drawbacks too ( e.g. arguably a higher focus on profit, less clinical freedom for vets, more remote management of day to day clinic happenings)."
From Vet Times May 2018
"Since the rules were changed almost 20 years ago to allow non-vets to own practices, the number of sites owned by corporate groups has grown to more than 1,700.
Independent Vetcare, the UK’s largest corporate with more than 500 sites, employs 2,800 veterinary professionals, CVS 3,250, Vets4Pets has 2,450, Medivet 1,850, VetPartners employs 1,250 and Linnaeus has 325 vets.
This means almost 12,000 vets and VNs work for a corporate veterinary group."
And this section from an article in The Times newspaper a year or so back highlights one of the potential consequences when huge corporations own the vet surgery as regards loss of individual choice when it comes to vets recommending what they regard as the best treatment for an individual pet and / or smaller scale companies being unable to compete when corporates use surgeries to promote their own products:
"A dogfight has broken out between Britain’s biggest chain of vets and a supplier of pet supplements that accuses it of misleading claims, of “losing the plot” and of being prepared to do anything in pursuit of profit.
David Haythornthwaite, founder of Vetplus, claims that his entire range of products, including his bestselling treatment for joint stiffness in labradors and alsatians, has been blackballed by the veterinary chain Independent Vetcare (IVC) at the behest of senior managers and private equity masters wanting to push own-brand products."
If it is impossible to find a truly independent, reputable veterinary surgery within a reasonable distance from your home, register with the one that offers the best service as regards out of hours care, quality treatment etc. but be prepared to resist unwanted offers of monthly payment plans for non-essential treatments (repeat vaccinations/ anti-flea and worm treatments). Easy to use worm count tests are available to purchase to check your dog for worm infestation and fleas are obvious to see if your dog has them and there is no need to treat unless affected. Once a puppy is successfully immunised against Distemper, Canine Adenovirus (Hepatitis) and Parvovirus, they do not need re-vaccination and a titre test can reassure if required that the dog has antibodies to those diseases. Re-vaccinating a dog that is already protected is a waste of money and, due to the potential health risks associated with over-vaccination, can be actually undermining the dog's health.
As Sam said above, try to find a vet that you can trust and is willing to discuss matters relating to your dog based on the most up to date advice (and common sense!) rather than with an eye to profit. A healthy dog should not need to be constantly at the vet surgery - we have dogs of 5 years and 8 years of age who have had only one vet visit since they were puppies, and the 5 year old only went when we needed the vet to perform a patella test as required by the breed Club - not because she had any ailment. She passed the test with flying colours too
Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole. ~Roger Caras
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