Barking whilst training.....

[mikegoodson1]

Hi,

I have a couple of questions so here goes, hopefully someone can help or advise on a course of action for me, as I am sure it's me not doing the right thing

I take Oscar to obedience training each week, a month or so ago he passed his bronze good citizen award and I felt training was going well. However when we are in a hall with other dogs and he is on the lead, he just wants to go over and play with them and if I hold him back, he barks at them. This may sound silly but not an aggressive type bark, more a 'play with me' bark! The instructor sometimes gets cross with me and tells me to turn Oscar away from the dogs so he is not facing them, which I do with the promise of some chicken (which I take as a reward treat). Now, when he is facing me, he is impatient for the chicken and if I don't give it to him promptly he 'acts up' (I guess by that I mean he makes impatient noises and will eventually turn away) until I give it to him, he is then quiet for a few minutes then starts the process again until I give him more chicken.

I am worried that where as previously I rewarded good behaviour (him sitting down in front of me quietly and staying there) now I am rewarding negative behaviour - any tips here?

He is 19 months old and I have never used a clicker, just a click word - I'm not sure if this helps any answers? I'm happy to try a clicker if that would help.

And my second question is around the barking. At home he barks when anyone walks past the house or he hears a noise and I tell him that he is a good boy for telling me someone is there and then he is quiet. This type of barking doesn't bother me, it's his job really.

He doesn't bark at dogs when we are on walks, on lead or off lead. It seems he only does it when we are doing training (agility or obedience) and he is in close proximity to other dogs and like I said, it's more a playful bark. I cannot help but feel we have got to a stage where he is testing the boundaries of what he can get away with and I reckon I must be not setting the boundaries correctly!

Thanks in advance,
Mike

[zeta1454]

As regards the training class, are there a lot of dogs in the class? For a number of breeds of dog including schnauzers they can get bored or frustrated if they have to wait around doing nothing. From my experience with training classes, if individual dogs are being worked one at a time, it can mean plenty of standing/sitting around and the more dogs in the class the harder this will be for a dog that wants to be doing something. Keeping class sizes to no more than 6 as an absolute maximum but preferably four means that dogs are actively engaged for more of the time. I am surprised that the instructor has not been more helpful to you - is this also a Good Citizen class? I have heard similar tales to yours of unhelpful instructors who are trying to get dogs through the requirements of the Good Citizen test but without taking a broader approach to helping people when there is a training issue outside this. Someone we know with a standard schnauzer was told to leave the class if she could not stop her dog barking - no advice given as to how to achieve that.

I would be tempted to try and find a different class / instructor, but, there are a couple of things that you can try with Oscar. From what you have said, the desire to play with the other dogs (and therefore barking at them) is much more interesting/rewarding than what is happening waiting with you for your turn to 'train' - even with the chicken! You need to work with Oscar on finding a way of holding his attention no matter what else is happening (or not happening!). I would try at home, out in the park..anywhere and everywhere you can, working on getting Oscar to sit facing you for a reward, building up from a minute onwards to however long you may have to wait in class...and only reward at the end of the set time.

The advantage of using a clicker is that the sound is always the same and differentiates from your voice. It also allows others to use the same sound if they are training with Oscar. However, if you have managed fine with a click word instead up to now, that may not need changing.

Dogs doing agility training do often bark in my experience if they are a vocal breed especially as this activity can get them quite excited but, if Oscar is only barking while waiting to take his turn, it is most likely frustration at waiting. As you say he is like this only in a "training" situation, I would not think that it is so much testing the boundaries as just finding it hard to settle and wait - training him to settle in distracting environments as often as possible and maybe upping the reward for a calm sit over an increasing number of minutes might help him to be better focused on you in the class. If there is a toy / a chew item / food that Oscar regards as an exceptional treat, you should be able to encourage him to focus more and maintain the focus in order to get an extra special reward. If there is a toy / chew item that Oscar favours, it could be worth keeping it hidden until you want to use it as a reward, making it even more desirable

I am always recommending this book ( and have no shares in it or commission ) but, if you are interested in training generally, this book is really good for anyone struggling with an independent minded dog such as a schnauzer:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/When-Pigs-Fly- ... 1929242441" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[mikegoodson1]

Thank you so much for your reply and helpful tips. I will definitely work on getting Oscar to sit in front of me, in a calm manner, to get a treat and work on extending the time before he gets the treat.

In terms of the training, there are between 4-6 of us in the class but sometimes there are longer gaps between exercises if one owner needs to work a bit more on a specific area. I also get frustrated with the 'stop your dog barking' approach, without being guided on how to achieve that, it's not as if the exercise classes are free, I'm paying for them! But like you said, there seems to be a lot of focus on passing the Good Citizens awards - I would prefer that these were used as a guide to obedience training rather than being back at school and following some sort of strict curriculum!

Anyway, rant over! I have the book you mentioned. It may have been you who recommended it in another post so I bought it but I'm ashamed to say it's still on my bedside table, unread! So I will get cracking on it tonight.

Thank you.

[Riesen16]

I must order "When-Pigs-Fly"

Mike, I have lived in Switzerland for many years and we have dog clubs for certain breeds and also dog clubs for every breed.

Whilst training each dog, the other dogs are either in the car or, in the kennels provided by the clubs.

The handlers can watch and learn from the tuition given by the Trainer and are not hampered by a restless dog at their side.

I used to have contact with a few English clubs who do working trials. Maybe you could put feelers out to see if there are any near you or at least a club for training dogs that works on the basis of what I said in my 2nd paragraph.

Another idea would be to form a group and train together??

In any case I wish you luck with your training.

Gill